Digitise your Leadership Brand Webinar with Julie Hyne and Amanda Blesing 14 May 2020

0:00:02.5

Amanda: Hi, everyone! And welcome to our fabulous Digitize Your Leadership Brand webinar. Today, I'm here with Julie Hyne, and my name is Amanda Blesing. And we are here to talk about all things branding yourself and performing really professionally in this new world of video.

Five reasons why you need to do video really well. The first one is, you never get a second chance to make a great first impression. Oh my gosh, if I think about all those videos out there that might not be sending a great message. Another reason is, if a picture paints a thousand words, then a video has the potential to paint a million, so why not leverage it?

The third reason is, well, video really connects far faster with someone. So, if you're trying to make a great impression, video has the potential to connect far faster, but it lingers longer, and hangs around in the ether forever. And have I got a story for that. I hope we get a chance to talk about that later today.

Number four, great leaders never hide, ever. And especially in a crisis. And number five, in my rulebook, she who does great video will definitely win in this brand new world.

My name is Amanda Blesing. I am passionate about helping women lead and succeed. And right now, that means I'm obsessed with helping women live and succeed in this online environment. You know when you wake up one day and you go, “Oh my gosh! I spent my entire career making everyone else look good, but I haven't done the same for myself.”?

So, what I do is I teach a really powerful approach to brand you. And I want to have your effort, but double your impact. So, Julie, you've been sitting there quietly, how about I just flick across to you and you introduce yourself and take it away, Julie?

0:01:54.6

Julie: Thank you so much, Amanda. Well, I'm Julie Hyne. And what I do is, you know how busy executive women often have a wardrobe full of clothes, but they’ll wake up in the morning, they've got a really important meeting and they think, “Oh my God, I just don't know what I'm going to wear, I wore that last time, I can't wear it this time,” and they’re totally flustered, and frustrated, and stressed about what they should be wearing to make that all important first impression?

Well, that's what I do. I take the frustration and stress away from that by helping them coordinate a really powerful and impactful wardrobe. That means they always have those outfits ready to go when they have to either fly out the door at a moment's notice or prepare for something that's really, really important.

0:02:44.8

Amanda: And I guess, right now, most of that is online.

0:02:47.8

Julie: Most of it is online. And I think what a lot of women are struggling with at the moment is, “How do I dress? Where do I draw the line on what's really professional compared to something that's a little bit more casual? How far casual can I go? And how much professional should I keep in what I actually put on every day to have my meetings?”

Look, there is a difference, but I guess in this environment, we've had to relax the rules a little bit and be a little bit more creative and differentiate ourselves. Which, I know this is a big topic we're going to be talking about today. So, that's really why we're here.

0:03:27.5

Amanda: Fantastic. So, now, while I've got your attention, it's so great to have so many of you online. This is the second webinar, we've sort of done on the same topic. Both Julie and I have been blown away by the interest and definitely at the engagement. We're getting messages after the webinar. So, we're in actual fact going to make this a regular gig. We've been brainstorming, maybe we call it a podcast, or maybe it's called style and substance, watch this space. But we're going to make it a regular gig, because it seems to be a real issue. And people are concerned about stuff.

But right now, it's your turn. I would like you to find the chat function on the Zoom webinar. So, we've got about a hundred people signed up again. Fantastic. So, I want you to find the chat function. I want you to switch it to all panelists and attendees, not just the panelists. So, send your message to all panelists and attendees. And I want you to say “Hi” from wherever you are while you're listening to this webinar.

So, if you're in sunny Brisbane, or anywhere, cloudy Sydney, or wherever you are, just give us a little context. Say “Hi” so that Julie and I can know who's online. We love to connect because both of us work one on one with people. So, we really love to know who we're speaking to.

Fantastic. All right. We've got lots of people. Canberra, Sydney, Brisbane, Gold Coast, great! Oh, I got another Amanda. I love it when there’s another Amanda. Have you seen a Julie yet, Julie?

0:04:57.4

Julie: No. I'm seeing a lot of Gold States. Gold States are coming in.

0:05:01.6

Amanda: Yet. Fantastic. Oh, good, good, good. All right. Sunny Hyatt, fantastic. Deborah, yup. Joanne, hi. Great, you could get in at the last minute. We had a couple of cancellations. Cabe, wonderful. All right.

So, if you just make sure that you're sending your message to all panelists and attendees, then everyone can see the chat. Now, why is that important? Because some of the best ideas and some of the best questions will come from you, the audience. And they will help us stimulate the discussion. So, at the end of the webinar, I'm going to edit the video down, and I'm going to edit the chat down, and leave some of the lovely ideas and suggestions from you, the audience members. We're all in this together. We're not going to get there and solve this big global sorts of problems. We've isolated individual responses. We need to be collaborating, so we can solve this together, too.

So, your best ideas in the chat box as we go. Fantastic. The other thing before we get started, and this is really important, because I'm really big on commitment in action, you're going to find one of these, that's a pen, remember them? Or a pencil. And I want you to find something, a bit of paper. This is my killer ideas book. I want you to find something to write something in. So, throughout the webinar, if you can't hear Julie or I say something you really like, and you go “Oh, that's definitely a suggestion I need to take note of,” write it down on a bit of paper.

Did you know that we are far more likely to remember something when we write it down? So, write it down on a bit of paper. And even at the end of the webinar, if you can maybe write a summary of the key things towards the end of the webinar, that would be great. You are far more likely to implement those things. All right, Julie, are you ready to go?

0:06:48.8

Julie: Let's do it.

0:06:49.9

Amanda: Let's do it. Fantastic. All right. So, let's give a quick snapshot of couple of the things that we talked about last time. So, the first thing is we'll do the snapshot, then I'm going to ask Julie some questions that have been a burning issue for me in particular. But also, I came up through the questions that you all submitted. And that is how to differentiate yourself.

Then we're going to swap over and Julie's going to ask me about how to really have impact in meetings. In particular, how to deal with being spoken over, all those sorts of things, because I'm really big on helping women. I make sure they stand out for all the right reasons, and not get talked over, and have really big impact inside these meetings.

All right, Julie, so one of the questions - quick wrap up from last week - one of the questions was, I'm looking really old and tired in meetings, and I'm sick of looking at my own old and tired face, I've got bags under my eyes, what can I do? What was your quick response there?

0:07:49.3

Julie: Well, I think the quick response from that is to make sure you're well hydrated, Amanda. Having worked in this industry and the beauty industry for a long time, hydration is one of the best things you can do to actually help keep the dark circles away from under the eyes. And if that doesn't work, if it's a hereditary thing, then yes, there are so many different products out there, concealers that can just help soften that. And also have really good lighting because if the lighting is not right, it can be casting shadows down on your face as well.

And the other thing, which I know will go into in a little bit of detail also, is the colors that you wear. You can add lightness and brightness to your face, or you can actually really cast shadows on your face based on what you're wearing as well.

0:08:36.3

Amanda: Yeah. Okay, great. All right. Now, I think one of the burning issues for me last week was around more of the technical stuff. The biggest technical piece of advice I can give you and I have been practicing this so hard, is look at the lens. Look at the lens. Clean your lens before a meeting. Because yeah, they get thumb prints on them and they get a bit murky.

So, clean your lens before a meeting, especially if it's important. And I put a little post-it note right near my lens just to remind me of where that lens is. That's the biggest tip that I could give anyone when you’re on a meeting. So, even when you're listening to someone, look at the lens. You don't want to get too fixed the stare, so you can look around a little bit, but do look at the lens.

Because emotional intelligence is dialed a bit in the digital medium. You're not picking up on other cues as well, like peripheral sounds, and although I did hear a bird in the background there, Julie, that sounded fabulous. [laughter]

0:09:46.2

Julie: I know. I’ve got trees outside my windows, so I’m sorry about that.

0:09:49.5

Amanda: Yeah, great. So that was my big tip. So, look at the lens. I think, also, which you mentioned about the lighting, and I just want to say, hey, I am soon to be the proud owner of a selfie light. I went online yesterday and purchased one, soon to be delivered. And I understand that that softens, there's several different shades that soften the skin tone, get rid of bags under the eyes, because I'm the same as everyone else.

All right, Julie, let's get on to the big question for today. Lots of people have asked this in the submitted responses. And so the big question for today is really, how do we go about differentiating ourselves? Because, basically, we all look a bit the same, we're a bit of a talking head. I'm struggling to -- I've got my own style on stage, wear trousers with knee-high boots and a big jacket, and that's my style on stage, and I can't do that here. So, I'm feeling like I'm just looking and feeling like everyone else. So, Julie, take it away, how do we differentiate ourselves?

0:10:54.9

Julie: Well, I know there's some of my lovely clients actually listening into this today. And one of the things I'll always talk to them about is, having those go-to outfits at the ready. And so that's knowing that you've got key pieces in your wardrobe to pull together so that you can create variety. And you don't need a lot of things to be able to do that. But you do need to understand style, and what styles actually really work for you based on this whole area.

Now, when we talk about image and first impressions, and when you're meeting someone for the first time or even beyond that, we talked about the vital V. So that area is from the center of the breast out to the tip of the shoulders, and anything that's upwards from there.

So, everything needs to be in a style that is going to be complimenting your face shape, your shoulder line, the length of your neck. So that includes, not only the color, but the style, how nice is it, is it clean, is it in good repair, what are you doing with your accessories. All of the things that are in this area, actually make a really big difference on how you come across to the other person.

So, that's from style. Then we can talk about personality style. So, what's your personality? How do you allow your personality to shine through with what you wear? I have a great fun quiz that I'm happy to share with everyone after all this, where they can go online, and you can actually determine what your personality style. And what does that look like in terms of from staff perspective. What sorts of clothes helped you project that type of personality. And then you can adapt that to the situation and the people that you're actually meeting.

So, that's the first thing. The next thing is to think about, well, what color should I wear? I mentioned briefly before, if you wear dark colors that can pass shadows, if you wear colors that are too light, it can sort of make you look a little bit sick and a little bit tired. So, knowing what colors to wear is also really important.

The next thing I think about is, well, what accessories am I wearing? Is that complementing the overall look? And can I have a few go-to outfits, but just different accessories that I can put on so that it actually differentiates me from how I wore that outfit last time?

And the fourth thing I think about is grooming. How well-groomed are you for this particular event? How are you wearing a little bit of makeup? Have you styled your hair? What things can you do to help you look really ready, and engaged, and fresh, and entertaining, and attractive to the person on the other side of the screen?

And then the last thing is, what's your extended image look like? What's your backdrop look like? Is that looking tidy? Is it aligned with who you are and what it is that you want to do? And I just have to apologize for those little bleeps you’re hearing on the background, because -- can I share something?

0:14:04.8

Amanda: Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead, Julie. Because this is really important. This is really important.

0:14:09.4

Julie: Always online. I said to Amanda, “Should I turn my Bluetooth off of my computer?” And she said, “Yes.” So, I lost my mouse on my desktop, and so I've had to quickly put my laptop in place to actually do this webinar. So, I haven't had a chance to turn off things. So, my apologies if you hear little bleeps coming through.

0:14:31.7

Amanda: But it was a really good example of what can go wrong. I used to have a rule before as a former CEO, I reported to a board, and I had a rule, never save any printing to do for the morning of the board meeting. Because nine and a half times out of ten, the printer would break down on the morning for the board meeting. It was never a fail.

So, I just had to instigate that rule. Never save anything to do until the morning of the board meeting. Same with our technology, we just have to have a backup plan. So well done, Julie. Maybe when I'm presenting you can fiddle around.

Now, you were talking about five key areas. And I reckon we could go back and expand on each one. So, what was the first area so that we all get it?

0:15:26.3

Julie: The first area is style, obviously.

0:15:28.9

Amanda: Yeah. And that's the big one for me because I reckon, there I am, I want to go on stage and I want to wear pants and boots. And here I am on this online environment wearing a jacket like everyone else. But how do we differentiate, what are some ideas that you might have thought of for that style sort of a space?

0:15:48.6

Julie: Okay. So, when you're thinking about what style of clothes you wear, we take into account every single part of your body, but let's just focus from the waist up because that's what we're doing. So, we look at shoulder line, neck length, face shape, all of these factors come into what actually is going to pull across the best -- project the best image of you when you're presenting online.

Now, last week, I had a jacket on. Now, when we're talking about women who want to project a more powerful presence, yes, a jacket always elevates a woman up into that space, as opposed to not wearing a jacket, which I'm not doing today. And I chose to only wear a shirt because this is more of a discussion today. We were getting into a little bit more nitty gritty, and it's all about coming across to be relatable and credible with what you do.

So, I chose white because it's a fresh color. It's a professional color. It's one which compliments me. I'm not fading into my background. And I just chose a simple accessory, something that just complements everything with me.

0:17:03.1

Amanda: Cool, fantastic. So, if there's any questions, because Julius has just been talking about that style and how to differentiate yourself, and maybe you're sitting there in the chat, you're going, “How does that help me?” We can sort of share photos and get personal advice. Obviously, if you want to reach out to Julie after the webinar to potentially work with her, that's a different issue, but if there's any questions about that sort of thing that you think might benefit the rest of us, pop it in the chat.

What makes it really easy for us to differentiate between just general chat, and hellos, and everything, is if you've got a question, put the caps lock on and type the question in capital letters. Normal chat, like just ideas and things, lowercase, but put a question in capital letters. And that might be a tactic you can take into some of your online meetings as well, because it helps the questions stand out from the regular commentary and the jokes that sometimes people on your Zoom meetings will be having.

All right. So, I'll keep my eye out for the question. So, Julie, number one was the style.

0:18:07.7

Julie: Yeah. So, make sure that you're wearing a style that actually works for you. Remember it’s from here, way up to here is what we’re focusing on. Getting everything in that area absolutely right, because if it's not right, it can either be a distraction to the person on the other side of the camera, it can sort of really just not give across the best impression how you would want.

Second thing was how to think about what your personality style is, and how can you add a bit of personality to what you're wearing, whether it's an accessory item, whether it's the color, whatever it might be. And as I said, there's ways you can determine what your personality style is.

The second thing is color. Now, color is really interesting. It carries a lot of psychological meaning, not just to you, but also to the person on the other side of the camera. So, what I've got here, I've got a few little props here, and I just wanted to demonstrate to you the difference color can make being you putting it close to your face, because let's face it, color is only really the most important when it's close to your face.

So, I have three different color boards here, which I'm going to show you the different --

0:19:25.7

Amanda: Ooh, I love it. I love the interactive nature of the Zoom, or Webex, or whatever meeting. I love it that we can do this. We can bring in props. And while Julie does bring in the color boards, that's a really important issue, don't rely on PowerPoint all the time, bring in props, because all of a sudden, this is making Julie's presentation really stand out. So, Julie, get on with the color. I can't wait. [laughter]

0:19:51.6

Julie: Well, something that I would take someone through when we're doing a full analysis, but I'm just going to give you a quick demonstration here today. So, this is actually -- I think you can see this. So, this is actually very typical of a cool light swatch, which is actually my colors.

0:20:08.3

Amanda: I was going to say, that look fantastic on you. I really like that. Yeah, great.

0:20:13.1

Julie: Now, if I --

0:20:14.0

Amanda: Yeah, just as well, huh. [laughter]

0:20:16.9

Julie: If I wore colors that were just a little bit too dark for me, can you see how that just -- and this is actually on the warm side of the spectrum, so it's really just not quite right for me.

I probably should take my glasses off today.

0:20:31.1

Amanda: I just want to interrupt. There's a few people popping through little comments. Make sure you pop through the comments to everyone. So, change it to all panelists and everyone. Then the chat becomes really rich, and that makes it a more meaningful discussion. So, pop through your comments to everyone, and your questions to everyone, not just our panelists. Fantastic.

0:20:50.1

Julie: This one actually is quite, again, a dark power. So, can you see how it's just not --

0:20:57.2

Amanda: They’re lovely colors. Like, they are beautiful colors.

0:21:00.9

Julie: For the right person, they’re lovely colors. But for me, it’s not right. The first one was the best one for me because it adds lightness, brightness, and it actually aligns itself with my natural coloring, which is cool, and it's light.

So, when I do a color analysis with someone, these are the sorts of things that we determine. And that also can help women correct things like incorrect hair color, and incorrect makeup colors. So that what you're seeing is you're seeing a really nice representation of yourself as opposed to something -- you know how sometimes you'll put something on and you’ll think “Oh, I just don't feel right” or “It just makes me look a bit sallow” and that's probably because you're wearing the wrong color or you're wearing the wrong lipstick color, or your hair color has been colored incorrectly by your colorist. So, often, that's what happened.

0:21:52.5

Amanda: Yeah. For years, I had very dark hair. And as I aged, that became -- my skin tone was changing, and I guess you might be thinking “Amanda, you've got very dark hair already,” but it's far softer now. Because as I aged, things changed and the dark hair was not doing me any favors, and certainly in an online environment. And for the last four years I've been doing Zoom client meetings, it really was not helping me. Now, we've got some great questions. So how about I’ll read some questions out to you.

So, we've got someone's asked, Caroline has asked, “What do you recommend about wearing scarves?”

0:22:31.8

Julie: I've got some scarves on here. I love scarves. Scarves are one of my favorite, favorite all-time accessory.

0:22:38.1

Amanda: Why? Why do you love scarves?

0:22:40.1

Julie: Well, I love scarves because you can add color to something plain. So, before, I was talking about having our go-to outfits, and you don't need to have a lot of these. So, you have some really good basic foundational pieces in your wardrobe. And to differentiate that outfit from this time to that time, you can use things like accessories. And scarves, for me, to the accessory item.

Again, you can emphasize color with scarves.

0:23:09.1

Amanda: Oh, that looks good. I love that one.

Last week, you showed that scarf that you had a different color on, and I think the contrast --

0:23:20.7

Julie: Now, this is really bright. So, for me, it's a little bit on the bright side. But this one, I love this one because this one has more of my colors, right?

0:23:32.1

Amanda: Okay, very beautiful.

0:23:33.4

Julie: So, with this, if I have plain white shirt, I could add a scarf around my neck for the next meeting and it looks completely different, or I could tie it in a different way. So, scarves are a fabulous way to change the look of something quite plain. And when you're projecting or when you're doing a Zoom presentation online, if you can work with a good basic core color, so a dark color, so when we're looking at suit colors, you've got a variety from the navy blues right through to the charcoals. And if you're on the warm side of the spectrum, you can go into the chocolate browns and the taupes.  So, it's about choosing the right basic color for you to start with, so that then you can add other colors to that whether it's in a scarf, or whether it's in an accessory item, lip color, all that sort of thing.

0:24:28.4

Amanda: Now, you and I had a quick discussion about lip color before the meeting, because let's face it - everyone, this is to everyone - whenever I go on a webinar with Julie, I feel a bit intimidated, honest to God. Julie works with CEOs around Australia, and I think New Zealand, she's super stylish if you've ever met her in person, super stylish, and I always feel like I have to dress my best. Julie did choose this jacket for me. [laughter]

So, I was happy to be wearing that today. But before the webinar, you suggested I asked you about my lip color, and you suggested I needed to lighten it a little bit so it would -- because I had a deeper color, what did you mean by that? Because that might be helpful.

0:25:12.0

Julie: Sure. Now, it's a tip I actually learned from a photographer many, many years ago when I was doing a photoshoot or something. I used to be modeling, this is a long time ago. And he said, “No, we're not going to put a red or bright red lipstick on because through the camera lens, that actually comes out quite dark. So, you choose a softer version of that. So, I've actually got quite a light pink on, but I know it's coming through the camera lens a little bit darker.

And also, when we look at lips shape, and how full your lips are, the darker the color lipstick you wear, the thinner your lips can appear.

0:25:51.8

Amanda: Ah, interesting.

0:25:53.3

Julie: And if you’ve got thin lips, you can make them look fuller by wearing a lighter color and a little bit of gloss.

0:25:59.5

Amanda: Not sure if that's really helpful for work. [laughter]

0:26:03.3

Julie: Well, it's all about how confident you feel, Amanda, and when the reflection you see of yourself in the mirror, if it's pleasing to your eye, then the chances are it's pleasing to someone else's eyes as well. So, things like, “I've got a really thin lip line and I'd like to try and emphasize that a little bit more,” not to come across like a bad way, but just to compliment your overall look. So, it’s just little tips that I take to my clients.

0:26:36.3

Amanda: Fantastic. Now, there's another really big good question. And it's about headsets. Does the size matter? This is from Tanya. I mean, I've got the headsets on and I'm doing that for a technical reason, so that the sound quality is better. And from my perspective, presenting with great sound quality is part of what I encourage my clients to be doing. But I know that some of them -- and I've opted for tiny little ones just because I am not a big headset girl. That's just not my brand. That is not my thing. What are your thoughts on the big headsets?

0:27:13.5

Julie: Look, obviously, yes, it encroaches on your overall appearance. So, it's whatever you feel most comfortable with. If you're having to have a really powerful meeting and clarity of what you hear, and sound, and everything else is really important, then the headsets become, I think, they just fade into the background, because you're just focusing on the content.

It really depends. And I guess this is the point we like to make with all impression management is always think about not just how you're presenting, but think about the person on the other side of the camera that you're presenting to. What are they expecting to see, what's the nature of the meeting, and what's the outcome that you want to get from them.

And I think that should determine everything about your planning leading up to that meeting and how you put yourself online. And maybe you need to connect with that person before and say, “Look, I'll be wearing headphones for this meeting because I want to ensure that I absolutely come across and I hear everything that you've got to say.” So, just be transparent, be upfront and honest about everything, and inform them beforehand.

0:28:33.2

Amanda: And I think that that's fair because, in actual fact, we're all in this together, aren’t we? Everyone's learning. One of my clients the other day, interviewed, it was second interview with a senior, the top partner of a firm, and by the way, she blew them out of the water. And we've done lots of interview roleplay in this video environment beforehand, and she interviewed upon a video. And she said he told her that she blew him out of the water with her interview.

And she said, “Well, it wasn't hard because he spent the meeting -- when he was talking, he was looking around like this. And when he was speaking, and when he was listening, he was doing things, and so I think that -- I can't remember exactly where I was going there, but we're all learning. That's right. We're all learning in this together, even sometimes the other people in the meeting.

And what you're saying is get the currency right. So, if the meeting is perhaps were a bit more conservative, where no one else would be wearing big headsets, don't wear big headset. However, if you're meant to be that edgy techie person coming into that meeting, then maybe wearing big headsets as a way to go. But if the meeting is a techie edgy sort of a meeting and everyone else has got the headsets on, then wear the big headsets. Is that what you're saying, Julie?

0:29:58.2

Julie: Yeah, look, absolutely. I know a lot of people that do podcasts on a regular basis and interview a lot, do wear their headsets. And I guess that falls in line with what it is they're doing. That's part of their profession, and so they would ordinarily wear headsets. I know a lot of my CEO clients are using them for their meetings, but they're presenting at a very high level, and they I guess they need to ensure that they capture everything that they're hearing.

It's horses for courses at the end of the day. I don't have any on today at all. Although, I was online at 6am this morning for a group Zoom call coming in from overseas, and yes, I did have my ear pods in this morning. I didn't want to wake up the rest of the house, but also, I needed to hear everything that was going to be said.

0:30:49.4

Amanda: Fantastic. Julie, one question before we sort of flip over on internet to ask me a question about having impact in meetings. Is this stuff sexist? I know there might be a couple of guys online because we don't restrict it. And both you and I do work with men. But is this stuff sexist? Is it a double-standard? Are we women having to do backflips? What's your opinion?

0:31:18.5

Julie: Really great question. And I know in a lot of the things that I put on LinkedIn, often are invariably I will get a comment about “Why should I have to do this? I should just be able to put forward my CV and that should be enough, I shouldn't have to worry about what I wear.”

Now, if that was the case, I wouldn't be in business, for a start. But secondly, there's so much information and so many statistics and proof out there that first impressions really do count. And I always just say, when you're going to meet someone for the first time, whether they've seen you on LinkedIn or they've found out something about you, you have a reputation that precedes you.   

And so, people have an expectation of what they're going to see even before they've met you for the first time. And if you're going for the next board role, or a big, big position, or an interview, your CV is on their desk, but that's not what walks through the door.

You are what is what -- I’m getting words tangled up here. You walk through the door and that's what they see. So, what they want to see is someone that is, okay, so this is exactly what I've read about. Well, I'm seeing someone that is professional, I'm seeing someone that's credible, I’m seeing someone that's actually taken time and respected herself enough in this interview to actually present well. They've thought about the role, they've thought about how they should dress to fulfill that role.

And let me tell you, I know if there is a board and, Amanda, you've been on boards, you know. But if you're interviewing for a new position, you're thinking about how trustworthy that person is, how credible they are, how confident they look, and are they going to be able to fulfill the requirements of that role.

And everything about how you dress is going to come across in a message. So, they're looking at trustworthiness, they're looking at likeability, they’re looking at how well you're going to serve them moving forward.

So yes, look, no, it's not sexist, it is an essential as far as I'm concerned, to really think about how you put yourself together and how you come across to your audience. And even so, these not for profit boards, where people are going out and they're actually looking to obtain funds for various activities that they do, you still to have to present because you've got to make a great impression on whoever it is that you're wanting to get funds from or wanting to get finance from to actually do what it is that you do. So, it is all about first impressions and the lasting impression that you make.

0:34:26.1

Amanda: And you would give the same advice to me. However, I would like to add, just in general, as always, the burden of overproof still remains with women. We are living in a sexist world, let's face it. 80% of leadership roles still go to men, so the burden of overproof still goes to women. And I guess that's what some of the women, when they're commenting, are frustrated with. Why is it that we still have to jump through hoops when a guy can put on a bag of fruit and tuna?

But the guy who's winning the role probably thinks -- he's also thinking a little. I know my husband has about 40 ties and you can see this deeply, which tie is right for which occasion, which color, etc. I mean, that might be overkill, I don't know, he loves his ties.

0:35:11.1

Julie: It's not overkill because color, as I said before, has real psychological meanings and so does pattern. And so, when we talk about personality style, which I never touched on before, you could be anything from a conservative dresser, a classic dresser, to an elegant, creative, dramatic, feminine dresser. So, all of these things play an important role in how you dress.

So, if you're wanting to come across to present in a certain way, even though you might be a feminine dresser, for example, you can still add an element of drama to create that powerful look. So, it's not silly that he's looking at all of these ties and thinking which one is going to be the most appropriate for this meeting, because it's all about the message that you're putting across, and the colors, because they also have psychological meanings attached to them. Not only to how it makes you feel, but how the other person feels. This is all of what I teach my clients. What colors to wear for specific types of scenarios and type of people that you're actually meeting.

0:36:19.3

Amanda: Beautiful. All right. So, before we go much further, I want to see if there's anyone still out there listening to us, Julie, don't you? So, we're going to have a bit of fun in the chat box, I want you to respond. The question is, what's the worst thing you've seen in an online webinar?

So, we've all seen these Zoom bloopers and naked peeping out to the toilets. But one of my clients the other day said that someone turned up to a work meeting on Zoom with a cigarette. So, what common mistakes are you seeing people making on webinars? If you could pop some of your ideas in the chat, that would be fantastic. And then what that does is provides us a resource of what not to do. So, pop any mistakes. Oh, yeah, scruffy beards. [laughter]

0:37:14.6

Julie: Two-day growth, hmm.

0:37:16.5

Amanda: Yeah. I think it might be a bit more, I think we've had a six-week growth. [laughter]

Well, let's face it. We've been in lockdown for quite some time now. Looking down into the lens. Yes, yes, and we'll get onto that shortly. Absolutely.

“I made a mistake, forgetting I was on camera -- and what was that - and I yawned really big.” Oh, fantastic. [laughter]

People are looking. [laughter]

0:37:45.3

Julie: (inaudible) (0:37:45.3) with themselves, that's a big one. And that's what you were saying before, Amanda, look into the camera lens.

0:37:50.4

Amanda: Yeah. Now, there is a great tactic on Zoom. And I don't know if this tactic is on other platforms, because I'm really familiar with Zoom. But you can actually hide self view. And when you hide self view and then go to gallery, you don't see yourself. And I think it's less exhausting, as well as less distracting. So that's my favorite setting. Because I work a lot, I'm on Zoom nearly all day every day. And it's exhausting. I beat myself up if I catch myself looking at myself. It feels a bit vain. So, switch that setting on hide self view.

All right. You get this side view as they're looking at another screen. Yeah. Now, you can do it. That is actually as a tactic. You can do it but come back and speak to the lens.

I went to the US to do my speaker training back on 2014 -- 2015. Michael Pore heroic speakership. It was pretty amazing. I met some amazing speakers from around the globe, Dorie Clark, for one. I saw some amazing people and I made a couple of fantastic friends. Hello, Dr. Molly Marty, if you're on this webinar.

I can't remember where I was going. My gosh, my brain’s a bit of a fudge. Where was I going? What were we talking about, Julie?

0:39:12.9

Julie: We're talking about speaker presenting.

0:39:16.8

Amanda: Yes, I remember now. Yeah, fantastic. All right. So, the big thing was, and I drummed into us. Imagine the camera lens is your best friend and speak to the camera lens like it's your best friend. And I sometimes forget that, I'm so busy flicking around or thinking of ideas. But imagine that when you're speaking in particular that the camera lens is in actual fact, your best friend, or someone really interesting. And all of a sudden, that brings out a bunch of energy.

All right. So, let's get on. There's a great list of things not to do. Don't beat yourself up. We can’t all be perfect. There's a great list of things on what not to do, and I'll share that after the webinar. So, Julie, what is it that you think people need to hear from me?

0:40:03.5

Julie: Look, you've touched on so many things, Amanda. We talked about the tactics. One of the sorts of things people need to do to prepare and plan to have a really effective meeting, and also body language, because whilst I can help them look fabulous, there's a certain code in terms of body language. I know eye contact is one of them, because we're talking about talking directly into the camera. But what other things can you talk about to help people come across in a more animated engaging way in the meetings that they're having?

0:40:43.0

Amanda: Great question. And just to reiterate, the video medium takes something -- we're a bit flatter. So, if I spoke like I'd normally do with a couple of my friends online, so they know when I'm out with the money, quirky, but if I spoke like I normally do in a professional environment, it's not very animated, is it?

This would be me in a board meeting. I'd be speaking, it's quite flat, but in the video setting, that doesn't work, we have to be a little bit more on. So, with all that in mind, let's address some of those issues. I'm going to park the questions about the preparation, because I've got a cheat sheet that I prepared after the last webinar that I'm going to send everyone.

It's got 22 items. These are my things that I do before I've plan for a webinar or important web meeting. Just things like look at the lens, claim to the lens, consider all, consider lighting, check my jewelry, check my makeup. Thank goodness ‘check my makeup ‘is one of the last things because I was already prepared to deliver a webinar last week. Beautifully prepared, beautifully groomed, ready to go, and I just went over to the mirror to check my -- you have a look in the mirror just before. And I had a big Joker -- you know the Joker, was a Heath Ledger movie, The Joker. I had a big lipstick mark because I had a drink. [laughter]

And I had a really big lipstick smile on. And I was like, “Oh my goodness, thank goodness that was on my checklist.” Checklists sounds stupid, feel free to laminate the thing. I go hiking really regularly. And I used to tease my husband about our hiking checklist, because when you're going less regularly, you forget things.

So, when you're podcasting, or webinaring, or web meeting, list frequently. You might forget things. It's great to have a checklist. So, I'll send that out. But the thing that really, I guess, Julie, the underlying question is, and I'm getting asked over and over again, my clients are telling me they're being mansplained, or they're being taught over, man-dominated, man-doctrinated. So, having talked over in meetings, they can't get a word in edgewise. If that's you, and if that's happened to you and it lasted a while, pop something in the chat, so we’ll know if that's happened to you.

So, people are telling me that -- I've got a board chair that I'm working with at the moment. And she's like, the other night, we had a really important meeting to talk about the direction of the organization and the funding for the organization, because right now everyone's in a crisis, and it was an hour meeting, and the blokes dominated with casual conversation until 10 minutes before the end of the meeting.

She said we couldn't get a word in edgewise to talk about that important stuff. Just before I came online, I was coaching a client, and a male colleague came to her and said, “One of your staff members actually was talked over five times in the last meeting, you need to tell her to do something about that.”

Well, for a start, the first thing we should be not forgetting, I think we are forgetting this, is we need to have a meeting plan, and influence plan, and socializing ideas plan. I think we've all forgotten how to do best practice meetings. Best practice meetings on important topics don't just happen. You don't just rock up, turn up to the boardroom table and have a great meeting. You've talked about the agenda items that are most important to you with other people. You've formed allies and alliances with other people who might say, “Oh, yeah, Julie, that's a great idea. I'd love to hear that from you again.”

There was a fabulous article a couple of years ago about Julie Bishop doing that, because it was her and two others in Parliament, and she said we were the sole female voices and we hardly got heard. And so, she and the two others formed an alliance. So, when Julie sort of landed an opinion or voicing an opinion, one or the other would always say “Julie, that was a great idea. Can we hear it again?” Whether they agreed with the idea or not, it was to make sure that Julie got fair ear to share time.

Okay. So, the first was meeting set up. You need to socialize your ideas before the meeting, you need to form alliances if it's really important, you need to make sure that the decisions are sort of made before the meeting even, you need to do the influencing

0:45:20.7

Julie: Sometimes having a game plan, isn't it? Because all of this, it's about playing the game. You can’t just rock up and expect everything's going to fall into place. Preparing yourself in terms of what you're wearing, having groomed yourself, but also in the preparation that you do, and knowing other people that are going to be on the meeting, if that's the case, having those discussions beforehand, I think that's just gold.

0:45:47.9

Amanda: Yeah. Now, the other thing is, and that's absolutely right, I think we've forgotten because we're all working remotely, we're not seeing each other in the corridor. So, it will take a bit of extra effort until we get it right. But I think we need to go back to planning how -- making a game plan, great word.

The other thing is, so we've got a game plan, and I think we need to think about (fair air) (0:46:13.1) to share policies and things like that. So, if you're a manager or a leader, or you're running lots of meetings, catalyst.org have great resources, I'll make sure I send out some of those resources with the webinar materials. But catalysts have great resources to consider, so that there is (fair air) (0:46:33.3) to share, so that you might have -- everyone does get a time to voice an opinion.

They need to have policies and strategies, use the meeting manager or meeting owner, need to make sure that's enforced. Or if you don't have them in your manager or isn't implementing, then you need to suggest it. Because organizations perform better when staff are engaged, and when diverse opinions are heard. So, it's really important to get that right. I'll share some resources.

And then finally, we're going to come to the actual setup. So, let's talk about setup. And you can -- I'm not sure how this will work, but for you, for the people listening, but for right now, we're going to look at my setup and Julie’s setup. One of the first things is to get your head near the top of the screen.

Why? I'm not sure, but I used to work -- I was working with a videographer, and he told me that. And since then, I've been analyzing lots and lots of video. And the people who are having most impact, their head is near the top of the screen. So, don't be afraid to cut the top of your head off, but your head near the top of the screen. And what that does is allow a little bit of your chest and throat to show. Because we need to rely on body language. Because only 7% of what you say is in actual fact, the meaning is conveyed. The rest is body language.

So, don't be afraid to speak with your hands. Don't be afraid to smile. Don't be afraid to just stipulate and be animated. And make sure that this part, the chest, the heart on an energetic level, you're connecting, and with a throat that connotes trust, and open communication. And be expressive with your face, your eyes, smile every now and then, too.

All right. So, that's body language. And, Julie, you talked about that V. What was it called?

0:48:33.2

Julie: We call it the vitamin V, Amanda. And it goes through the center of the breast out to the tip of the shoulder. Everything else above that as well is what really needs to be looking sharp, looking on point, looking appropriate for who it is that you're meeting, the situation, and what it is that you want to achieve from that.

So, and that will come -- so if you're feeling really confident about all what's happening here, then your message is going to come through. And you don't have to be distracted, or concerned about, or second guess, “My God, I hope I'm coming through okay, I hope I look okay, I hope they’re buying the right message because you've done your homework,” and you'll be absolutely 100%.

0:49:18.9

Amanda: So, the vital V, really important. And it's really interesting that the executive presence from the style world, and then the content from this digital world on having more impact in making presentations, it's all dovetailing together.

This is really important, because if you don't want to be spoken over, this will have impact. Because imagine if someone does speak over you and you are being a bit more animated, let's face it, they won't if you are presenting with power, but they’ll less likely. But if someone does interrupt, you could, “Excuse me, Brian. I was making a point.”

Imagine how powerful that would be. You could just stipulate like that. So, you can try those sorts of tactics. Other thing is, make sure that your screen is not tilted back. See, I've got far less power like that. See, you can see the ceiling. It’s not good at all,. I'm just a little bubblehead. I just look a bit silly.

Whereas, when you bring the screen vertical, it's far more real. So, you want your eyes in line with the camera, your lips just above the midway point of your screen, and your screen upright. So, there you go. That's how to present with power, and making sure that you're not spoken over. Because if you're presenting with an animated way, clearly, articulately, you got a smile in there every now and then, you maybe use a hand gesture, “Talk to the hand” might be a bit over the top.

I did once have someone in a job interview say that to me, worst job interview ever, “Talk to the hand.” [laughter]

That's a story for another day. Now, I'm just going to check on my list there. One of the big mistakes, and I've seen this a few times, you might have seen it on LinkedIn, there's been a funny video about it as well, is when sometimes people are trying to make a point, they lean into the camera, and this is really -- don't do that. You don't need to lean into the camera. Make sure you fit the frame, your back, you look relaxed.

And also, you don't want to shout. You don't want to get caught with high emotion. The video last forever. Now, I was going to tell you --

0:51:40.1

Julie: You’ve made a good point, Amanda.

0:51:41.9

Amanda: Yeah. I was going to tell you a story about video lasting forever. Some years ago, in early in my SEO career when I was the CEO of SOCAP Australia, I was interviewed on video with the Commonwealth Ombudsman. Now, I was totally overwhelmed. He was a very important person in our industry. He was also one of the wise men of industry, he'd been around for years, he was an icon. And I was totally overwhelmed and really nervous about the interview. Plus, I hadn't done much video. And he was the consummate professional, he's done a lot of television as well.

So, there is this really odd, somewhere on YouTube, interview of me floating around, this is my morning video last forever. A really odd interview of me looking really uncomfortable, incredibly nervous, and with no animation whatsoever. And it's somewhere floating around on YouTube. Don't google me, don't try and find that place. But that's the importance of getting this right. Go for it.

0:52:57.0

Julie: Because you could look up any person who is in the public eye, and google them, and that will bring up photos of them from a while, so you can see the transformation a lot of people have gone through to get to where they are now. But if you think that's all in the past, and people won't find things like that of you, you're wrong, so hence the need and you should place importance on making sure that whenever you're going to be captured on camera, or you're going to be videoed, that you are presenting yourself in the best possible like any one that's going to carry you through to where it is that you want to go. Because it is once you're in print, that's it. It's done. It's there. You just can't remove it.

0:53:50.1

Amanda: So, true. There's one other -- whoops, sorry, I didn't mean to do that. There's one other quick -- what I'm trying to do is share the survey link in the chat. So, I'm just trying to get that right. We've got a little survey, just an evaluation of the webinar. And I know that some of you have to leave early, so I just want to share that on the chat.

One other quick important thing is the head tilt. I do that. Don't do the head tilt, it connotes less power. So, if you're trying not to be spoken over, trying to be taken seriously, trying to present, get your voice heard, don't do the head tilt and don't touch your face. Flicking here, touching face, very distracting, also comes across as feel underprepared and little girl

So, head tilt, touching face are no-no. So, don't do that. Julie, is there anything else you'd like to say while I try and work out how to send a chat to everyone?

0:54:50.6

Julie: Look, think we've sort of covered off a lot of detail in the webinar we did two weeks ago and again today. I think the overriding message from us is to do your preparation, do your planning, think about who it is that you're actually having a meeting with, what's the image that you want to actually be putting across to these people, and it's a great time, ladies and gentlemen, to actually be looking at your wardrobe, and thinking about does my wardrobe give me what I need moving out of COVID-19, and maybe going into some more face to face meetings.

I know I had a phone call yesterday from a lady who was exactly in the situation. And she said, “You know, I'm looking at my wardrobe now, and I'm not sure whether it actually serves me. And whether it's how I want other people to save me now moving forward.”

So, it's a great time to revisit all of this, to get it right, to think about maybe it's time to form a review, maybe it's time to look at my style of clothes I've got, maybe it's time to look at how I do my hair, revisit my makeup application techniques, think about what colors I should be wearing, and am I really expressing myself the way I want to express myself.

And so, that would be my parting message to you all is to really, really think carefully. We are moving out of this, where all things are being sort of really rough. So, you do a review.

0:56:34.8

Amanda: Yeah, fantastic. Look, everyone, we've ran out of time. Once again, Julie, hasn't that been fabulous? It's been great.

0:56:42.3

Julie: Yeah, great!

0:56:43.9

Amanda: Yeah. And I think both you and I can talk about this sort of stuff forever. The work we do fits really well together, often, your clients come work with me, often, my clients go and work with you. And the work we do dovetails really well, and I think both of us are a bit fascinated by this. My logical hair says it's not fair. But the other part of me goes, “Actually, if no one cares as much about my career as I do, so I need to do whatever it takes to make it happen.” And the same for you. No one cares as much about your career as you do.

So, let's do whatever it is we need to do to make it happen. Yeah. So, Julie, my final point would be, be the leader you need to see online, be the leader you need to see online. Now, Julie, is there an offer or a course or something that you've got available?

0:57:41.5

Julie: Yes. Well, being locked down like everyone else has forced me to think very carefully about how I deliver my services to my clients and to other women who might be interested in going through this process. So, I've been very busy developing the tools to be able to do all of this in an online virtual scenario, which means it opens up to a lot of other women who may be at Interstate that thought, “Oh, it's too hard, I’m Interstate.” It's not too hard. Everything is possible in a virtual scenario.

So, that program is very much down the track, and hopefully to launch very soon. So, if you're interested, yes, do get in touch with me, I have a wait list, which I'm forming at the moment. And I'm very excited to launch.

0:58:31.2

Amanda: Fantastic. And if anyone is interested in working with me, right now, I've been working with a lot of clients on this sort of online presence. So, I've taken my older program, which you know, the pre COVID-19 program and I've broken it down into two chunks. So, first is executive rescue because there's a lot of people out there who really -- they've might be done and a bit of help.

So, if you need career services, absolutely. I've got a quick pivot package now. But then what I've done is spent some time really thinking about this new online world because, as I said before, she who nails this video on online world will definitely win. So, I've been thinking about all the core components that is we need in our career, to read this online stuff, and how to build your brand online, and for executive, so profile building.

So, I've packaged that all up now. That includes regular little sessions with me and some of my other tribe on video performance. And we get feedback and we encourage each other. In actual fact, one of my clients put the video up on LinkedIn just earlier this week, and it's gone absolutely gangbusters. And it's her first video, and she should be really proud. It's a great content, well-produced, she looks amazing.

So, there you go, Julie, any final words? No? Oh, good.

0:59:53.9

Julie: I think that's great. And I just like to thank everyone who is still here because there are small groups still here. I know time is valuable at the moment and, hopefully, you've been able to have some really great takeaways.

1:00:10.0

Amanda: Beautiful. All right. Thanks, everyone. Wonderful to have you online and look out for Style and Substance Digitize Your Leadership Brand in another month’s time. Okay, bye.

1:00:20.4

Julie: See you, bye.